並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/%E5%85%AB%E8%A7%92%E7%B1%A0%E7%9B%B4%E6%92%AD-ep-3-%E6%96%B0%E7%96%86%E6%80%8E%E9%BA%BC%E6%A8%A3/id1106847606?i=1000544451951