並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/tw/podcast/ep56-%E8%A6%8B%E7%AF%89%E7%99%BE%E8%AC%9B-%E9%AB%98%E9%9B%84%E4%B8%80%E7%99%BE%E7%A8%AE%E7%B6%93%E5%85%B8%E5%BB%BA%E7%AF%89-%E5%9F%8E%E5%B8%82%E5%A5%BD%E8%AE%80%E6%9B%B8-%E5%88%86%E4%BA%AB%E4%BD%A0%E8%88%87%E5%BB%BA%E7%AF%89%E7%9A%84%E6%95%85%E4%BA%8B/id1521848244?i=1000516226624